For follow-up discussion and general commentary on the topic. Comments are sorted chronologically.
Kenneth Heck
I believe the initial report of Mark 5:35 of the girl's death was false. She was actually only in a coma, as asserted by Christ in 5:39. The difference between death and a coma can be difficult to determine by those without appropriate medical training.
Gary Wainwright
Luke 8:55 NASB says 'And her spirit returned, and she got up immediately; and He gave orders for something to be given her to eat.'
It is evident she was already dead when Jesus arrived because her spirit had already departed.
Kenneth Heck
It isn't quite clear what happened with the girl since it was her "spirit," not her soul that returned to her. Death is defined as the separation of the soul from the body, not the spirit.
The difference between the "return" of the spirit and simply waking up isn't clear, since sleep implies the quieting or quiescence of the spirit into temporary inactivity.
It continues to be part of a number of religions that when a person is asleep the soul (or spirit) can temporarily leave the body in a dream state, only to return upon waking up.
Of course, this doesn't apply to Christians, unless they are actually taken up as part of an extraordinary dream or vision given them by God. These dreams may seem so real that the person can't distinguish them from reality until they have woken, and attempting to waken them in the middle of the experience isn't as easy as it would be normally.
Gary Wainwright
Is a person a body/soul and a spirit or is a person a body and a soul/spirit? The body on its own is not a soul. Furthermore, the soul/spirit is the breath of life.
What is the breath of life? https://www.gotquestions.org/breath-of-life.html
“Man is more than “dust” or physical substance. Man has a spirit. We can picture it this way: Adam’s body had just been formed by God from the dust of the earth—a lifeless human body lying on the ground. Then God leaned over and “breathed” His own “breath of life” into the man’s nostrils; God is the Source of life, and He directly placed life within man.”
Strong’s Hebrew 7307 ‘ruach’ definition ‘breath, wind, spirit’.
Strong’s Greek 4151 ‘pneuma’ definition ‘wind, breath, spirit’.
Luke 8:55 ‘And her spirit (pneuma) returned…’
It is evident from above her spirit had departed because she was dead, therefore Jesus raised her to life again when He woke her up from her ‘sleep’.
Kenneth Heck
Jesus said both Lazarus and the man's daughter were sleeping. But he also clearly said that Lazarus was dead, and that the girl was not dead. I take Christ's statement literally that she was never dead and did not come back from the dead.
There are certain diseases (epilepsy, Parkinson's) which can mimic death through catalepsy, a stiffening of the muscles and insensitivity to pain. People have been mistakenly buried alive due to this condition in prior centuries.
Also, certain psychoactive drugs commonly used by shamans can give the appearance of death.
There is the possibility of witchcraft applied against the man or his family which could have normally resulted in burying the daughter while alive
Of the four possible causes of sleep, witchcraft seems to be most likely, since the others normally apply to adults. The man as a ruler of a synagogue may have made enemies. The girl needed food, as prescribed by Christ, since she had presumably been asleep for more than a day under the sleeping spell.
Kenneth Heck
It should be noted that in Rev 1:10 that John was "in the spirit." There was no mention of him being dead or as good as dead before he returned to his body to write everything down.
Similarly, when Paul was caught up to the third heaven, 2Cor 12:1-4, there was no implication that he was dead until he returned to his body.
Death, as I understand it, is the permanent separation of body and soul - return of the soul isn't possible. Rigor mortis and disintegration of the body begins - the first to be affected is the brain due to lack of oxygen. Thus, the second greatest miracle other than Christ's resurrection appears to be Lazarus' return from the dead.
Gary Wainwright
Please note Revelation 1:10 states “I was in the Spirit…” not I was in my spirit.
In 2 Corinthians 12:1-4 Paul states he did not know if the man was either ‘in the body’ or ‘out of the body’. It appears there were no eye witnesses to this event possibly why when Paul wrote 2 Corinthians afterwards he still did not know nor had the Holy Spirit reveal it to him.
While Paul may or may not have had an out of body experience, the New Testament does not say Jairus’ daughter did.
https://www.gotquestions.org/out-of-body-experience.html
Kenneth Heck
When is sleep only sleep, and when is it a euphemism for death? There are plenty of instances of both usages in the bible. The context is decisive.
Why would Christ first say she wasn't dead, but then also use a euphemism for death? I don't believe she was both dead and not dead. (We are not dealing with Schrodinger's cat here which can be both until actually observed.)
I believe the simplest solution is to believe that Christ's words were literally true, and that the beliefs of the surrounding crowd were literally false. Rom 3:4 "Let God be true, but every man a liar." The crowd was in error due to the false appearance of death.
Gary Wainwright
Was it possible for Jairus’ daughter to be present in two places simultaneously, i.e. present in her body while also present in her spirit which had departed her body (Luke 8:55)? Since no person can be present in two different places at the same time means she was in her spirit and not in her body.
Secondly, can the body function without the breath of life (wind, spirit) in it? Adam’s fully formed body was lifeless until God breathed his breath of life (wind, spirit) into it, therefore Adam's body only became alive when his soul/spirit entered it. This means Jairus’ daughter’s body was also lifeless until her spirit (wind, breath) returned to it.
Lastly, since Jesus is the “Resurrection and the Life” (John 11:25), He can speak to things that are dead and raise them up again – because to Him, they are just asleep.
Kenneth Heck
I think this may be a matter of translation implications. Modern translations are not always the best.The King James Version, which I mostly use, says in Luke 8:55 "And her spirit came again..." So, the spirit came at least twice. This doesn't precisely mean that her spirit returned as if it were somewhere away from her body. It means that her spirit came from the state of sleep and she awoke a second time. The first time or prior times the spirit came was when she awoke before she fell into that sleep resembling death.
This is what I mentioned in my first comment - when we are physically asleep, our spirit is inactive and must come from inactivity to full activity for a person to become awake.
Gary Wainwright
The New King James Version reads ‘Then her spirit returned…’ which is the same as per NASB translation. The Greek word translated as ‘returned’ (Strong’s Greek 1994 ‘epistrephó’) is correct as the Greek word means ‘to turn’ or ‘to return’.
Therefore, we can conclude her spirit did return to her body when Jesus commanded her to arise (Mark 5:41).
Kenneth Heck
What is death? Do we really understand death even today? I don't believe physicians always know when death occurs, although they do use practical rules to approximate the truth.
Take for example this boy recently in the news who was supposedly dead for 15 minutes - http://abc7chicago.com/society/teen-dead-15-minutes-comes-back-to-life/3439247/ Was he really dead, or did he only manifest certain customary signs of death? In the final sense, I believe it would be up to God whether a person is truly dead or not. Traditionally, it will take up to three days for a soul to permanently separate from the body.
The crowd around Jairus' daughter based their opinion on what they saw and heard, not divine insight or revelation.They were totally convinced of her death. But Christ, with divine authority, knew better, and proceeded to wake her out of her sleep. Death exists only according to God's Will (permissive or otherwise) , not according to the will or judgment of human beings. You can't be dead unless God permits you to be dead.
Gary Wainwright
Death causes the separation of the breath of life (soul/spirit) from the body, i.e. the soul/spirit departs the body.
In the case of Jairus’ daughter, even if the eye witnesses had misdiagnosed her condition, the word of God confirms in Luke 8:55 that her spirit returned to her body therefore if she was not dead then her spirit would not have departed in the first place.
Why would a person’s spirit leave the body first followed ‘traditionally’ up to three days later by their soul? How is it possible for a person’s soul and spirit (breath of life) to be in two separate locations at the same time?
Kenneth Heck
Death is the permanent separation of soul from the body. It is up to God whether a separation of body and soul is permanent or not. True separations (as with Lazarus) can occur, and can seem to occur (as with the girl).
To say that her soul (or spirit) had completely left her body isn't warranted from the account. It is more likely that her soul had only partially left her body, if at all. Since Christ said the girl wasn't dead, whatever the situation was between her body and soul did not qualify as a death, as was with the case of Lazarus.
Man is composed of body, soul, and spirit. The first death permanently separates the body from the soul and spirit. The second death destroys the soul (Rev 20:14)
and perhaps the spirit. There is no separation of spirit from soul while both are connected to the body.
The word "spirit" can be used in a variety of ways and in Luke 8:55 may only be a euphemism or explanation for the process of waking up.
Gary Wainwright
Where does the Bible teach that the soul can partially leave the body? The breath of life (soul/spirit) is either in the body or it has already departed.
While the word of God is able to divide between the soul and the spirit (Hebrews 4:12), the Bible does not say the soul and the spirit will be divided when the body dies so that the soul remains behind for a period of time while the spirit departs immediately.
As mentioned previously, the Greek word in Luke 8:55 clearly teaches the spirit returning therefore it is not "a euphemism or explanation for the process of waking up'. Only the original languages are the Word of God as He inspired it.
Kenneth Heck
As I understand it, for Christians the body contains the soul, and the soul contains the spirit. The spirit isn't independent of the soul - using the word spirit in Luke 8:55 is a matter of semantics and would include the soul. Once the breath of life is in the body it becomes the spirit and is permanently united with the soul (unless there is a second death afterwards).
The separation of body and soul doesn't take place instantaneously. It takes some time, as I have said, up to three days. See Gen 35:18, for example. The bible is a book of life, not a book of death, so we don't get detailed descriptions of the numerous situations during and after death in the bible.
The fact that the girl awoke "straightway" after Christ said his words implies that there was little if any true separation of body and soul, since otherwise there would be a noticeable lapse of time for the soul to fully return to the body. This is why I
believe it was a partial separation, at most.
In the case of Lazarus, Christ had prayed to the Father in advance for Lazarus (John 11:41) before he commanded Lazarus to come forth. We do not know exactly when he prayed, but it did give the Holy Spirit enough time to return the soul to the body and to restore the flesh. It was not an instantaneous miracle.
Gary Wainwright
We will have to agree to disagree therefore this will be my last comment.
The breath of life is the soul/spirit which when united with the body results in a living soul (1 Corinthians 15:45), i.e. a human being is not a body/soul and a spirit because they are a body and a soul/spirit (my second comment posted above refers).
What is the breath of life? See www.gotquestions.org/breath-of-life.html
To reiterate the soul (breath of life) does not remain in the body at death while the spirit departs on its own so that one’s soul and spirit is separated from each other.
Strong’s Greek 5590 ‘psuché’ definition (a) the vital breath, breath of life, (b) the human soul, (c) the soul as the seat of affections and will, (d) the self, (e) a human person, an individual.
5590 (psyxē) corresponds exactly to the OT 5315 /phágō ("soul"). The soul is the direct aftermath of God breathing (blowing) His gift of life into a person, making them an ensouled being.
http://biblehub.com/greek/5590.htm
Kenneth Heck
Brother Wainwright, I believe we are in agreement as to the nature of the body, soul, and spirit.
In your first comment, you said "It is evident she was already dead when Jesus arrived because her spirit had already departed."
I have tried to point out that it takes time for the spirit to depart, so that complete departure cannot be presumed, rather at most it was a partial departure for the girl. With full departure, of course, she would have been dead, contrary to Christ's own words. I cited Gen 35:18 as an answer to your question, "Where does the Bible teach that the soul can partially leave the body?"
I believe our disagreements will be resolved eventually, as Christians progress further in biblical comprehension.
Danny Hickman
A coma and death; you don't have to have a PhD to know a dead body from one that's comatose.
Without the use of metaphors, allegories, symbols, axioms, adages and proverbs, there would be no Bible.
The prevalence of these literary practices is the main reason for Bible study confusion. People want the Bible to be a 'strictly by the book' instructional manual. It's anything but that! Those who need a rule book won't understand the first thing about it.
To a man who can call the dead back to life, death is the same as sleep. You don't have to be a Dallas Seminary graduate to come up with that. It's very basic.
The premise of the question is that since Jesus knows everything, he knew the girl was dead, so if he said she was only asleep, he spoke an untruth. So, could it be said that he lied?
No! It couldn't be truthfully said that he lied; he was a teacher; he was teaching, not conducting a court case. If you want to learn, learn when the scriptures are to be understood literally and when you're to understand them in a figurative sense.
It isn't a mistake that the scriptures are so misunderstood; it's intended to be that way. "Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, so that I should heal them." (Matt 13:15) That's not how it's meant to happen. Understanding intellectually isn't God's method, it is man's. Man wants to do it himself; God isn't interested in man's need to think highly of himself. So, he doesn't allow him to understand unto salvation.